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Project Euler #912: Where are the Odds?

(projecteuler.net)
165 points fzliu | 3 comments | 14 Oct 24 20:27 UTC | HN request time: 0s | source
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joshlemer ◴[15 Oct 24 02:06 UTC] No.41844227[source]▶
I've been thinking recently about how things like Project Euler, LeetCode, and to a bit less of an extent, Advent of Code, are so heavily focused on making clever use of math, data structures and algorithms, that it makes them suboptimal as a tools for getting familiar with a new programming language.

I know that that critique isn't new to anyone but it makes me think about how it would be cool if there were a code puzzler site that is specifically geared towards little self-contained tasks that are more to do with forcing you to get familiar with the common everyday tasks of software development.

Some example puzzlers could be like:

- open an http server on port 80

- open a file and write this data to it

- write temporary files to a location, deleting them when process exits

- query a database

- deal with such and such error scenario

- find a way to test this component

- bundle this code as an executable

- sanitize user input here

- make this behavior configurable

- take the config from environment variable variable and/or config file and/or arguments

- parse this data file

You do get a bit of parsing and file handling with Advent of Code but imagine a series of dozens of small problems that grill you on every corner of the python filesystem api. Would be a lot less dry than reading docs cover to cover.

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port19 ◴[15 Oct 24 07:30 UTC] No.41845862[source]▶
Most of these wouldn't qualify as "puzzles", would they?

I find it nice to learn new languages via data structure puzzles, because to me the data structures of a language feel like the grammar and once I have that down everything else falls into place

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1. joshlemer ◴[15 Oct 24 15:51 UTC] No.41849820[source]▶
I disagree. Yes, you have to learn how to work with the basic data structures of a language, but 90% of programming, for most people, is not that. It's IO, error handling, db querying, logging, input parsing, parameterization, business logic, preserving backwards compatibility, persistence, state management, testing, mocking, benchmarking, build design (for lack of better term -- futzing around with Make/Gradle/Npm, Dockerfiles). All of that doesn't just fall out of learning DS/Alg's, it takes time to become familiar and fluent in how all these are done in your ecosystem.

When employers or team mates ask you if you "know" or "are competent in" Java they don't care if you know how to work with lists, arrays, loops, hashmaps and sets. Well, I mean, that's table stakes. They're asking if you're familiar with the idiosyncrasies of the language with respect to those above concerns.

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2. xigoi ◴[15 Oct 24 16:38 UTC] No.41850382[source]▶
I think you overestimate the proportion of programmers who primarily work on corporate stuff.
3. port19 ◴[16 Oct 24 10:48 UTC] No.41857620[source]▶
Imo DS/Algs to an extent are a good prerequisite. Once you know them in one language that knowledge is portable enough to get you up-to-speed in $lang. Then, and no earlier will I start worrying about doing real things in my programs and the "idiosyncracies"