←back to thread

303 points FigurativeVoid | 1 comments | | HN request time: 0s | source
Show context
jstrieb ◴[] No.41842593[source]
Relevant (deleted, as far as I can tell) tweet:

> When I talk to Philosophers on zoom my screen background is an exact replica of my actual background just so I can trick them into having a justified true belief that is not actually knowledge.

https://old.reddit.com/r/PhilosophyMemes/comments/gggqkv/get...

replies(3): >>41843302 #>>41848022 #>>41848257 #
CamperBob2 ◴[] No.41843302[source]
Hmm. That seems like a better example of the problem than either of the examples at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gettier_problem .

The cases cited in the article don't seem to raise any interesting issues at all, in fact. The observer who sees the dark cloud and 'knows' there is a fire is simply wrong, because the cloud can serve as evidence of either insects or a fire and he lacks the additional evidence needed to resolve the ambiguity. Likewise, the shimmer in the distance observed by the desert traveler could signify an oasis or a mirage, so more evidence is needed there as well before the knowledge can be called justified.

I wonder if it would make sense to add predictive power as a prerequisite for "justified true knowledge." That would address those two examples as well as Russell's stopped-clock example. If you think you know something but your knowledge isn't sufficient to make valid predictions, you don't really know it. The Zoom background example would be satisfied by this criterion, as long as intentional deception wasn't in play.

replies(5): >>41844783 #>>41845544 #>>41845689 #>>41845828 #>>41848089 #
1. roenxi ◴[] No.41845689[source]
Well ... obviously any Gettier-style example will not have enough evidence because someone came to the wrong conclusion. But there is a subtle flaw in your objections to Wikipedia's examples - to have a proper argument you would need to provide a counterexample where there is enough evidence to be certain of a conclusion. And the problem is that isn't possible - no amount of evidence is enough to come to a certain conclusion.

The issue that Gettier & friends is pointing to is that there are no examples where there is enough evidence. So under the formal definition it isn't possible to have a JTB. If you've seen enough evidence to believe something ... maybe you'd misinterpreted the evidence but still came to the correct conclusion. That scenario can play out at any evidence threshold. All else failing, maybe you're having an episode of insanity and all the information your senses are reporting are wild hallucinations but some of the things you imagine happening are, nonetheless, happening.