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204 points WithinReason | 3 comments | | HN request time: 0.001s | source
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mrweasel ◴[] No.40715746[source]
An once that becomes generally available operating systems will eat the bandwidth in an instance and any speed-up to be gained on a desktop will be completely negated.

It seems like we're stuck at a pre-set level of latency, which is just within what people tolerate. I was watching a video of someone running Windows 3.11 and notice that the windows closes instantly, which on Windows 10 and 11 I've never seen there NOT be a small delay between the user clicking close and the window disappearing.

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vladvasiliu ◴[] No.40715815[source]
> which on Windows 10 and 11 I've never seen there NOT be a small delay between the user clicking close and the window disappearing.

Isn't that delay related to the default animations? On my particular machine with animations disabled, if I click the minimize button, the window disappears instantly. This is your standard win11 on a shitty enterprise laptop running some kind of 11th gen i7u with the integrated graphics and a 4k external display.

Maximization is sometimes janky, but I guess it's because the window needs to redraw its contents at the new size.

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PlutoIsAPlanet ◴[] No.40715875[source]
Modern operating systems render to buffers on the GPU and then composite them, which I would guess adds some latency (although likely unnoticeable).
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LoganDark ◴[] No.40716455[source]
It's not unnoticeable. Ever notice how on Windows, when you start to drag a window, your cursor disappears for a frame? That's Windows replacing your cursor with a software-rendered one so it doesn't appear ahead of the window. But drag anything else (i.e. browser tabs, text highlighting) and you'll quickly notice it lagging behind the cursor. Why? Because the cursor is a hardware overlay that can be moved before the composition is actually complete. The composition lags one frame behind. In other words, the price of the compositor is lagging one frame behind. That may not sound like much, but it is, especially when most displays are only 60 FPS.

Of course, it's only one of the contributing factors to the total latency of things like keystrokes: https://danluu.com/input-lag/

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PlutoIsAPlanet ◴[] No.40717112{3}[source]
Hardware planes will hopefully reduce the latency again as it will allow windows to skip the compositor and allow mapping parts of the framebuffer to a window buffer.

I believe there's some work on Linux already for them, but I'm not so sure on Windows. I would be surprised if macOS doesn't already use them in some capacity given Apple's obsession with delegating everything to firmware on a co-processor.

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1. LoganDark ◴[] No.40717536{4}[source]
> Hardware planes will hopefully reduce the latency again as it will allow windows to skip the compositor and allow mapping parts of the framebuffer to a window buffer.

Hardware planes are great but there are a limited number of them. Right now I believe Windows only uses them for the mouse cursor, and exclusive fullscreen.

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2. zamadatix ◴[] No.40719900[source]
Windows 11 has pushed the use of MPO for windowed games and video display.
3. PlutoIsAPlanet ◴[] No.40721023[source]
Arguably the only window that needs to be in a hardware plane is the window currently in focus.