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ICJ orders Israel to prevent genocide in Gaza, stops short of ordering ceasefire

(apnews.com)
517 points xbar | 12 comments | 26 Jan 24 14:35 UTC | HN request time: 2.245s | source | bottom
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ajb ◴[26 Jan 24 18:36 UTC] No.39146163[source]▶
The actual rulings can be found at https://www.icj-cij.org/sites/default/files/case-related/192...

and a summary is: https://www.icj-cij.org/sites/default/files/case-related/192...

Dissents etc can be found in the case page: https://www.icj-cij.org/case/192 - in particular the opinion of Judge Aharon Barak, the Israeli ad-hoc Judge (a peculiarity of the ICJ is that each side gets to add a judge, but it doesn't have much effect since there are 17 other judges). But interestingly Judge Barak ruled against Israel in the case of two measures, enforcement against Incitement and ensuring humanitarian aid.

I believe it's also available in French, for those more familiar with that language.

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throwaway421967 ◴[26 Jan 24 23:10 UTC] No.39150104[source]▶
Since the comment that I replied to was flagged, I'm posting this here because it is simply a statement of facts.

- Judge Barak's numbers on civilian deaths on 7th october are simply wrong and could've been easily checked. 766 civilians were killed, 1200 was the total number of deaths (including armed forces).

- Israel's own numbers say "2 civilians killed for every one militant"[1], that's 66% in the Gaza offensive.

- 766 / 1200 = 63.8%

- 63.8% and 66% are indeed close numbers, don't see why would it be flagged.

Of course, the numbers claimed by other NGOs / UN make it worse. But Israel's numbers are sufficient to make that claim.

[1] - https://edition.cnn.com/2023/12/05/middleeast/israel-hamas-m...

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Qem ◴[27 Jan 24 01:52 UTC] No.39151574[source]▶
Regarding the people that died on October 7, one important detail is evidence surfaced it appears a sizeable fraction was killed due to Israeli military attacking militants and hostages without distinction, to avoid capture, following the so called Hannibal directive:

https://thecradle.co/articles/israeli-army-ordered-mass-hann...

https://thegrayzone.com/2023/11/25/israels-october-7-propaga...

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hannibal_Directive

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1. shakil ◴[27 Jan 24 02:44 UTC] No.39151898[source]▶
Why is this flagged/down voted? Its just a plain statement of fact, supported by credible sources and references. Here's some more references if people think this didn't happen. The IDF attacked and fired on the Nova festival goers with Apache helicopters [1], an Israeli tank fired shells at Kibbutz Be'eri killing hostages and children, and stories of eight babies killed at the kibbutz have been proven to be false, among other things [3], [4]

1. https://www.businessinsider.com/idf-mistakenly-hit-festival-...

2. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Be%27eri_massacre#Survivors'_t...

3. https://archive.is/Zn3Bt

4. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L91kG_bYsn0

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2. brighteyes ◴[27 Jan 24 03:10 UTC] No.39152071[source]▶
It is downvoted because it said "sizable fraction", which is a conspiracy theory.

It is true that there were a few incidents, but they only account for a very small fraction of the death toll.

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3. rsoto2 ◴[27 Jan 24 03:17 UTC] No.39152119[source]▶
The report that I saw said that there were 70 vehicles completely destroyed by RPG or Helicopter and the Israeli military did not go into specifics(although they undoubtedly have more data about the event than they have released)
4. wahnfrieden ◴[27 Jan 24 03:41 UTC] No.39152295[source]▶
“A few… A very small fraction” is a conspiracy theory actually
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5. wahnfrieden ◴[27 Jan 24 06:17 UTC] No.39153107{3}[source]▶
IDF says “immense quantity” of friendly fire, that doesn’t sound like your “a few”:

Israel’s army on Tuesday admitted that an “immense and complex quantity” of what it calls “friendly fire” incidents took place on 7 October.

The key declaration was buried in the penultimate paragraph of an article by Yoav Zitun, the military correspondent of Israeli outlet Ynet.

It is the first known official army admission that a significant number of the hundreds of Israelis who died on 7 October were killed by Israel itself, and not by Hamas or other Palestinian resistance factions.

Citing new data released by the Israeli military, Zitun wrote that: “Casualties fell as a result of friendly fire on October 7, but the IDF [Israeli military] believes that … it would not be morally sound to investigate” them.

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6. weatherlite ◴[27 Jan 24 12:51 UTC] No.39155117{4}[source]▶
A significant number of Palestinian casualties are killed by Hamas misfires
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7. SomeoneFromCA ◴[27 Jan 24 13:14 UTC] No.39155279{5}[source]▶
Did you just make it up?
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8. reducesuffering ◴[27 Jan 24 13:34 UTC] No.39155403{6}[source]▶
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Ahli_Arab_Hospital_explos...
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9. SomeoneFromCA ◴[27 Jan 24 14:01 UTC] No.39155587{7}[source]▶
"While this is not a conclusive finding, it is currently considered the likeliest explanation based on the evidence gathered in investigations conducted by the Associated Press, CNN, The Economist, The Guardian, and The Wall Street Journal.[7]"

No official investigations made (only statements made by pro-israel media eraly in conflict), no proof thefore. Yet israel has track of bombing the Gaza hospitals, which makes aposteriori a more plausible explanation for the incident.

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10. wahnfrieden ◴[27 Jan 24 14:18 UTC] No.39155731{8}[source]▶
Regardless a failed rocket launch is a different matter from the Hannibal Directive which is deliberate lethal attack on their own hostages. The official directive was retired in recent years but is still practiced per Israeli reporting.

> The Hannibal Directive (Hebrew: נוהל חניבעל; also Hannibal Procedure or Hannibal Protocol) is the name of a controversial procedure that was used by Israeli Defense Forces (IDF) until 2016 to prevent the capture of Israeli soldiers by enemy forces. According to one version, it says that "the kidnapping must be stopped by all means, even at the price of striking and harming our own forces."

> Israeli newspapers have reported that the IDF was issued orders echoing the wording of the Hannibal Directive during the 2023 Hamas-led attack on Israel. The IDF was ordered to prevent "at all costs" the abduction of Israeli civilians or soldiers, possibly leading to the death of a large number of Israeli hostages.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hannibal_Directive

11. dang ◴[27 Jan 24 19:29 UTC] No.39158933[source]▶
You can't post like this to HN, regardless of who you have a problem with. It's not what this site is for, and destroys what it is for.

We have to ban accounts that post this way, so if you'd please review https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and not post this way, we'd appreciate it.

12. weatherlite ◴[28 Jan 24 07:51 UTC] No.39163399{8}[source]▶
There's lots of proofs of misfires, hospital incident aside Hamas and Islamic Jihad rockets are in many cases low quality and disintegrate in the air or just miss completely and land in Gaza. I'm sure you can find articles about it if you wanted to look.