←back to thread

ICJ orders Israel to prevent genocide in Gaza, stops short of ordering ceasefire

(apnews.com)
517 points xbar | 4 comments | 26 Jan 24 14:35 UTC | HN request time: 0.001s | source
Show context
locallost ◴[26 Jan 24 21:36 UTC] No.39148816[source]▶
My views on the situation aside, the clearest I saw anyone communicate the issues from a global angle was the former French prime minister Dominique de Villepin

Translated here: https://twitter.com/RnaudBertrand/status/1718201487132885246

Viewed from the angle of the West, I think the message it needs to avoid isolating itself from the world is very unusual for Western media and important.

Quote:

"Westerners must open their eyes to the extent of the historical drama unfolding before us to find the right answers."

And

"This Palestinian question will not fade. And so we must address it and find an answer. This is where we need courage. The use of force is a dead end. The moral condemnation of what Hamas did - and there's no "but" in my words regarding the moral condemnation of this horror - must not prevent us from moving forward politically and diplomatically in an enlightened manner. The law of retaliation is a never-ending cycle."

replies(6): >>39148909 #>>39148934 #>>39148966 #>>39149209 #>>39150381 #>>39151344 #
RcouF1uZ4gsC ◴[26 Jan 24 21:46 UTC] No.39148966[source]▶
> The law of retaliation is a never-ending cycle

How many wars have the US and Japan fought after WWII?

Or France and Germany after WWII?

How many wars have the US Government and Native Americans fought after 1900?

Sometimes a clear, overwhelming victory ends cycles of violence.

replies(7): >>39149136 #>>39149261 #>>39149293 #>>39149332 #>>39149489 #>>39149724 #>>39149967 #
1. svara ◴[26 Jan 24 22:35 UTC] No.39149724[source]▶
That France and Germany are now good neighbors is a miracle.

It's possible because wise humans on both sides realized that the law of retaliation would cause a never ending cycle.

I worry that this sort of wisdom might be in short supply these days.

replies(1): >>39150406 #
2. RcouF1uZ4gsC ◴[26 Jan 24 23:35 UTC] No.39150406[source]▶
> That France and Germany are now good neighbors is a miracle.

It was not because of wise humans as if humans suddenly learned wisdom. It was because they both realized instead of being empires acquiring territory, they had instead been turned into players between the US and the Soviet Union who were both much stronger than either of them and that war would end up completely devastating both of them without any benefits.

replies(2): >>39150856 #>>39152072 #
3. svara ◴[27 Jan 24 00:24 UTC] No.39150856[source]▶
Cynicism may sometimes seem smart, in this case it leads you to stupid conclusions.

While another war between France and Germany would have been unlikely for the reasons you state, it absolutely wasn't a given that the countries would develop cordial relations given their shared history. I call that a miracle. It's something we owe to de Gaulle, Giscard d'Estaing, Helmut Schmidt, François Mitterrand, Helmut Kohl and others -- others in their place may very well have chosen a different path.

History is full of examples of countries being hostile to each other even though cooperation might be beneficial in the long run. In fact, it's probably true for the Israel/Palestine war as well.

4. awb ◴[27 Jan 24 03:10 UTC] No.39152072[source]▶
A few things emerged after WWII that probably helped keep the peace:

* democracy

* capitalism

* US military presence

* common European allies

* a shared dislike of communism

* a need to focus internally to rebuild destroyed infrastructure