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ICJ orders Israel to prevent genocide in Gaza, stops short of ordering ceasefire

(apnews.com)
517 points xbar | 16 comments | 26 Jan 24 14:35 UTC | HN request time: 1.502s | source | bottom
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aaomidi ◴[26 Jan 24 19:00 UTC] No.39146547[source]▶
I do think that their future Feb ruling is going to call for a ceasefire. If they called for one now, Israel & especially the US were just going to ignore it and reduce the power of the court.

Israel has created a beast that I don't think they can control themselves. I do think that the court is going to get more legitimacy after they explicitly tell Israel to __chill__, for Israel not to chill, and then get the ceasefire ruling against them & potentially an intensification of the genocide case.

Meanwhile, unfortunately, real people are suffering so these political games can be played.

I am so deeply disappointed in the Biden administration here. They're throwing away a lot of the good work they've done, and are actively getting Trump elected. People, naturally, do not want to participate in an election that is giving them a choice between ${person_currently_helping_a_genocide} and ${person_that_will_intensify_genocide}. You're just going to get voter apathy, and the consequences from that.

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1. xenospn ◴[26 Jan 24 19:22 UTC] No.39146881[source]▶
I can assure you Israel will most likely ignore any resolution that does not involve the hostages returning.
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2. GordonS ◴[26 Jan 24 20:31 UTC] No.39147841[source]▶
If they cared about the hostages, they wouldn't be bombing them to death on a daily basis, shooting those that escape, or gassing them in tunnels. The hostages are nothing more than political pawns to Netanyahu.

Keep in mind that Hamas reiterated their ceasefire deal recently, which includes the release of all hostages, and Israel rejected it.

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3. SomeoneFromCA ◴[26 Jan 24 21:41 UTC] No.39148878[source]▶
Hostages are undesireable for Israel, as earlier they die/be killed the lesser leverage hamas will have. Besides, they will all be dangerous to official narrative, as they seem to have been treated ok by the militants.
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4. pgeorgi ◴[26 Jan 24 22:01 UTC] No.39149194[source]▶
You mean they were raped ok by the militants? https://www.ndtv.com/world-news/there-wasnt-a-moment-freed-h...
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5. Gunnerhead ◴[27 Jan 24 03:14 UTC] No.39152101{3}[source]▶
Not this claim in particular, but existing claims of rape allegations have been debunked:

https://x.com/jonathan_k_cook/status/1748390405173842099?s=4...

Meanwhile, Josh Paul, a former US State Department official, detailed how a 13 year old kid was raped in an Israeli prison and “The State Department's inquiry into the case resulted in Israeli officials shutting down the charity involved in bringing the case to light.”

https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/20231205-resigned-us-state...

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6. cma ◴[27 Jan 24 04:11 UTC] No.39152470{3}[source]▶
Are you talking about the Netanyahu quote at the end of the article only?

Otherwise there isn't a direct rape claim in there, but a witnessed missed period which they say could be due to rape or the witness also says it could be due to the harsh conditions (malnutrition is a real cause of it in some cases; Washington Post has reported on worries of refeeding syndrome in some of the released hostages so some were severely malnurished). I found an article with longer excerpts of the testimony and the dolls on a string quote was about inappropriate clothing provided and claims of abuse but the testimony excerpts there also didn't directly allege rape. Is the full transcript of the hearing out there somewhere?

7. halflife ◴[27 Jan 24 04:41 UTC] No.39152644[source]▶
It also included the release of the thousands of terrorists that were captured in Israeli borders in oct 7th. People with actual blood on their hands, and a guarantee for hamas to stay in power.

Moreover, Israel offered hamas a ceasefire if they release all the hostages and exile their top 6 leaders. That offer was rejected by hamas.

So please don’t present such a one sided view

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8. GordonS ◴[27 Jan 24 09:23 UTC] No.39154001{3}[source]▶
> Moreover, Israel offered hamas a ceasefire if they release all the hostages and exile their top 6 leaders. That offer was rejected by hamas.

That wasn't a serious ceasefire offer, and you've left out the reasons why: it was a pause of 2 months, not a ceasefire offer at all! Furthermore, Israel wouldn't release the hostages they are holding. Why would anyone agree to release the hostages in exchange for nothing but a brief pause of genocide?

Netanyahu knew Hamas wouldn't agree to it; he only even made the offer because he'd turned down the Hamas offer first, and so needed a different story for the media to run with. Which worked just fine of course - MSM ran with "Hamas reject ceasefire" without even mentioning the Hamas offer.

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9. halflife ◴[27 Jan 24 09:28 UTC] No.39154017{4}[source]▶
And a ceasefire offer from Hamas that releases thousands of killers while absolving Hamas from any wrong doing is a serious one?
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10. GordonS ◴[27 Jan 24 09:38 UTC] No.39154057{5}[source]▶
"thousands of killers" is just rhetoric; Hamas could argue that the IDF hostages they hold were "killers".

Meanwhile, many of the hostages held by Israel are held without even being charged. From what I've seen, it's quite obvious that many are innocent civilians, and hundreds of them are children.

We've also seen evidence that Israel tortures its prisoners, and that rape is endemic - which is probably why Israel won't let the Red Cross near them (something else it complains Hamas won't do).

Israel is behaving like a rogue state.

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11. halflife ◴[27 Jan 24 10:00 UTC] No.39154186{6}[source]▶
1 year old baby can be argued as a killer? Meanwhile the actual killers were caught live while killing Israelis in their homes in oct 7, they even filmed themselves and bragged about it. Pretty damning evidence. Conflating the hostages to the Israeli prisoners is terrorist rhetoric, not genuine rhetoric. Palestinian prisoners had access to the Red Cross up until oct 7, at which point the Red Cross was pretty useless and one sided against Israel.

Do you have any proof of rape accusations being endemic?

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12. xenospn ◴[27 Jan 24 10:29 UTC] No.39154357{4}[source]▶
There are Hamas rape videos, you can easily find them using a simple reddit search. Please stop spreading propaganda.
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13. ◴[27 Jan 24 10:38 UTC] No.39154412{6}[source]▶
14. GordonS ◴[27 Jan 24 10:42 UTC] No.39154440{7}[source]▶
> 1 year old baby can be argued as a killer?

Strawman - I explicitly referred to those hostages that were members of the IDF.

> Conflating the hostages to the Israeli prisoners is terrorist rhetoric

Ah, so anyone who disagrees with you is a terrorist? I see you.

You're also implying that all hostages held by Israel were involved in the attack on 7/10 - blatantly untrue. Several Israeli soldiers are on camera saying they take Palestinians hostage purely so they have something to exchange with Hamas - this has been going on for years.

> Red Cross was pretty useless and one sided against Israel.

I'm sorry, but this is the kind of nonsense that spokespeople (like Eylon Levy) and career racists (like David Colier) like to espouse - everyone who disagrees with Israel's genocidal actions is an antisemite and/or Hamas lover. "The Red Cross are Hamas". "The UN are Hamas". Honestly, it's pretty pathetic.

On Israeli guards torturing and raping Palestinian prisoners, including children, there is a wealth of evidence and many, many video interviews with victims. Here is just one story: https://electronicintifada.net/blogs/tamara-nassar/israel-cr...

15. SomeoneFromCA ◴[27 Jan 24 10:43 UTC] No.39154447{5}[source]▶
These have not independently confirmed. There is a history of passing by israel of Mexican cartel videos and photos of military women perished in other Middle Eastern conflicts as atrocities commited by Hamas .

I am not saying that Hamas did not (or did) commit the crimes on videos, it just the source is so reliably untrustworthy, so the videos cannot be taken seriously.

16. Gunnerhead ◴[27 Jan 24 14:27 UTC] No.39155813{5}[source]▶
So what I shared, a well thought out article by Johnathan Cook and others, is propaganda but you telling me to watch unverified, often debunked videos that are actually from cartels or ISIS, isn’t propaganda? What’s next, should I search 4chan?