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688 points hunglee2 | 3 comments | | HN request time: 0s | source
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mmastrac ◴[] No.34713024[source]
It's a great story, but it's all unsourced and could be a decent Tom Clancy story at best. You could probably write a similar one with Russia or German agents as the key players and be just as convincing.

The only anchor in reality appears to be Biden suggesting that they knew how to take it out which seems like a pretty weak place to build a large story.

What I find particularly odd is that this entire thing appears to be based on a single, unnamed source "with direct knowledge of the operational planning".

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drewda ◴[] No.34716271[source]
Seymour Hersh has decades of credibility from reporting the My Lai Massacre to the abuses at Abu Graib.

But he does often rely on sources who remain anonymous: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seymour_Hersh#Use_of_anonymous...

I did find it interesting in that Wikipedia article to read that The New Yorker's editor insists on knowing the identify of all of the anonymous sources that Hersh has used when his reporting is published in that magazine. That suggests to me that while Hersh can probably be generally trusted, his work is of a higher quality when it's published in an outlet like The New Yorker, as the editor-in-chief and other staff submit it to a more rigorous internal discussion. That's in comparison to probably no internal review or discussion by Substack.

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slantedview ◴[] No.34717161[source]
Biden stated last year: "If Russia invades [Ukraine] there will be no longer a Nord Stream 2. We will bring an end to it." [1] This was a clear threat, clear as day, that the US could destroy Nordstream. It should surprise nobody that the US was involved.

Since Nordstream was destroyed amidst public pressure from US energy companies who wanted to takeover the European energy market, the US has become the world's leading exporter of liquid natural gas, Europeans are paying record natural gas prices, and US energy companies are reporting record profits. Again, the relationship between these things should surprise nobody.

1: https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2022/02/08/bidens-bi...

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bandyaboot ◴[] No.34718890[source]
> This was a clear threat, clear as day, that the US could destroy Nordstream [2]. It should surprise nobody that the US was involved.

Or you could take a breath and realize that Nordstream 2 was not yet complete. It was an ongoing, non-operational project. In that context, “bringing it to an end” could easily mean not completing it. In fact, that’s the far more reasonable interpretation—-the literal physical destruction interpretation is only made by someone who wants to believe that.

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vintermann ◴[] No.34721949[source]
This reminds me of the old defense of OJ Simpson, that in fact only very few of men who domestically abuse their wives go on to murder them.

And yeah, that is true. But when the wife was in fact murdered, then the odds that the known abusive husband did it are very high.

Maybe it was a reasonable interpretation that he didn't mean blowing up the pipeline, before the pipeline was blown up.

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bandyaboot ◴[] No.34725900[source]
> men who domestically abuse their wives

> known abusive husband

Not sure what you’re referring to here. If you’re analogizing what Biden said with domestic abuse, that’s just ridiculous. It’s more akin to telling the wife they’re going to need to divorce if she doesn’t stop threatening the children. If you’re saying the US in general has a history of doing things that could be compared to domestic abuse, sure, but so could all parties involved, particularly Russia. So we’re back at square one.

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1. vintermann ◴[] No.34726857[source]
I knew you would take offense at the comparison.

But it's not a comparison, it's just an example of the same statistical dishonesty.

When the pipeline was in fact blown up, of course we're going to look at vaguely worded threats in another light.

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2. bandyaboot ◴[] No.34731205[source]
> I knew you would take offense at the comparison.

I was stating my opinion that the comparison was of low intellectual quality, not taking offense.

> When the pipeline was in fact blown up, of course we're going to look at vaguely worded threats in another light.

Except it’s only vaguely worded if you’re approaching it from the bias of wanting to think it was a threat of blowing it up. Approaching it a different way, they’re just the words a person would use if they were talking about ending the project, not literally blowing it up.

If Biden were going to be so aggressive as to threaten to blow up an infrastructure project of a close ally, why specifically limit it to Nordstream 2? “We’re going to lose our ever-loving minds here, but only for phase 2 of the project”.

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3. tarboreus ◴[] No.34748888[source]
How would Biden "end the project?" Say pretty please?