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242 points raybb | 1 comments | | HN request time: 0.202s | source
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BugsJustFindMe ◴[] No.26717442[source]
> While communication is guaranteed to be secure due to the end-to-end encryption implemented in the open-source client apps and the Signal protocol

So the client is open source and guarantees end-to-end encryption regardless of what the server does. Ok, then I honestly don't care. Why should I?

I use Signal for its safety characteristics, which as stated are apparently ensured by the client regardless of what the server does, not because of the server, and I continue to agree with Moxie that federation is a white whale that doesn't solve any regular person problems.

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belorn ◴[] No.26718332[source]
If you think the security aspect of the server don't matter, then can I please have all the metadata that get generated on the server and which only security is the public statement by Moxie Marlinspike that they do not save the logs or store them.

The client only guarantees security in term of the message content. Who talks to who, when, where, how long, and the historical patterns are secured by the policy of the server provider. Trust in the server is critical.

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tptacek ◴[] No.26718348[source]
This is really silly. Signal has discussed repeatedly what metadata they keep. It might be sane to ask questions about that, except that every competing messenger keeps the absolute worst case metadata, generally in plaintext, nicely bundled up in SQL tables. At best, you'd be making the claim that Signal might... secretly be as bad as everything else.

And, of course, the source code does nothing to do address this concern; they control their servers and can run any secret fork they want. It's a purity test and nothing more.

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1. belorn ◴[] No.26722577[source]
Be kind. Don't be snarky. Respond to the strongest plausible interpretation of what someone says.

Trust is a personal relationship. I am not making a claim that such trust should be abandoned because they delayed an update and did not transparently and openly communicated with the community about what they are doing on the server side or why. A personal relationship is personal, and what is or isn't a problem in building and maintaining that trust is up to each person.

I do however claim that the placed trust in signals servers is critical for the security, and that the server side security matter. Who runs the server matters and what the server code does also matters.