←back to thread

298 points elorant | 2 comments | | HN request time: 1.437s | source
Show context
komali2 ◴[] No.21574384[source]
Aight, conspiracy theory time.

I'm becoming concerned about PRC influence in my country (USA). From my perspective the PRC (government) is blatantly evil, and happily engaging in cultural warfare, and nobody seems to be fighting back.

I see absurd astroturfing and shilling on social media here (Reddit, Twitter, Facebook). It's always obvious - whereas a genuine criticizer of the Hong Kong protestors might ask about violence, the shills will always use the word "ISIS" somewhere in their message.

It's everywhere and we don't seem to be fighting back. I browse Chinese social media and while my Mandarin isn't great I'm not seeing any level of AstroTurfing at all. So am I just a crazy conspiracy person? Is the PRC astroturfing not a big deal? Maybe my concerns are valid but that doesn't justify further concern about the influx of PRC messaging vectors to the USA, i.e. tiktok?

When I worked in the PRC I got to see first hand the strong-arm of the Party. Every business involved in communication had a government official whose entire job was to ensure the company "protected the social wellbeing of the people of the PRC" or similar. I can only assume tiktok has the same and I can only assume it's a matter of time before the Party starts directing the company to leverage their access to a massive US audience in a way that benefits the "social wellbeing," i.e. by disseminating PRC propaganda.

replies(20): >>21574430 #>>21574539 #>>21574613 #>>21574635 #>>21574656 #>>21574774 #>>21574822 #>>21574838 #>>21575081 #>>21575457 #>>21575566 #>>21575579 #>>21576032 #>>21576254 #>>21576412 #>>21576442 #>>21576575 #>>21576672 #>>21576865 #>>21577032 #
logicchains ◴[] No.21574635[source]
The way I see it, the Chinese government doesn't care what you do as long as you don't challenge it. The US on the other hand seems intent on enforcing its whims everywhere on the globe it can. War on terror, war on drugs, war on encryption, war on financial privacy, war on intellectual property infringement. To quote CS Lewis: "It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience."
replies(4): >>21575180 #>>21575322 #>>21575447 #>>21575460 #
kp98 ◴[] No.21575180[source]
You are wrong: I am familiar with the CS Lewis quote

1) In this case the nation working behind the scenes is China. American imperialism I concede is bad. However, the Chinese have quietly been breaking over 50 international regulations and laws from the WTO and universal declaration of human rights.

2) The Chinese do care what you do. Just last week the Swedish government was going to give an award to an activist in Sweden, and the CCP threatened the entire country - pathetic. The Australians said they do not agree with Chinese human rights violations, so they were denied entry (clearly they care). I also question how one can determine what is "challenging" the CCP when it is a mercantilist nation with hands in every basket.

3) Enforcing the war on drugs all over the world? Like asking China not to ship fentanyl? Sure.

4) America is pushing the war on financial privacy? Hello, have you seen Alipay and Wechat before? Do you realize cash is still a major way that some people get paid in America? Perhaps in swift you could argue undue transparency, but wire transfers are a different subject.

5) American intellectual property infringement? ...do you mean like the Chinese forced intellectual property transfer?

Lastly, on the CS Lewis quote. America is constantly at odds with its conscience. Half the country is constantly calling out the other half. In China if you don't tow the imperial / mercantilist line your social credit goes down and your freedoms are limited.

replies(3): >>21575608 #>>21575766 #>>21576227 #
yourbandsucks ◴[] No.21575608[source]
It's been like a week since the last US-backed Latin American coup.
replies(1): >>21576460 #
1. thanatropism ◴[] No.21576460[source]
Yeah, but US-backed != US-hatched. The proximal cause is that Bolivia had fallen into a state of utter chaos (therefore a power vacuum); the proximal cause of that is that the president tried to pull off a Xi Jingping but this didn't play even with much of the population that initially backed him.

It's the difference between setting a house on fire to acquire the land, and buying a land lot where a house used to be.

replies(1): >>21580357 #
2. yourbandsucks ◴[] No.21580357[source]
That's certainly the official US line on the matter.

How has the official US line held up, historically, when it comes to coups vs socialists in Latin America? Why should it be different this time?