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    298 points elorant | 29 comments | | HN request time: 1.065s | source | bottom
    1. m12k ◴[] No.21573454[source]
    "It is the third most-downloaded app outside of gaming this year. Numbers one and two are WhatsApp and Messenger, while four and five are the Facebook app and Instagram."

    Facebook owns 4/5 of the most downloaded apps - just let that sink in for a minute. This space needs competition pretty badly.

    replies(7): >>21573503 #>>21573514 #>>21573962 #>>21575036 #>>21575045 #>>21578638 #>>21578683 #
    2. wil421 ◴[] No.21573503[source]
    There was competition and FB used their war chest to buy them all, sans messenger. They forced people to download messenger to see FB messages on mobile. They also lied and said you had a message when you really didn’t. Just to force the messenger download.
    replies(4): >>21573909 #>>21576182 #>>21577442 #>>21581094 #
    3. bertil ◴[] No.21573514[source]
    This is less because Facebook is big and more because it’s the largest tech company without an OS. More people use Google or Apple’s native Mail client, browser, calendar.
    replies(1): >>21574075 #
    4. mhluongo ◴[] No.21573909[source]
    Didn't they acquire Messenger as well? I think it was called Beluga
    replies(3): >>21574201 #>>21574999 #>>21575946 #
    5. axegon ◴[] No.21573962[source]
    While I do agree that this space needs competition, I can't see a scenario in which this can happen. The combined user base of all the facebook apps is a considerable percentage of the world's population. Take out people with no access to internet or living in dictatorship or dictatorship-like regimes and you get probably north of 90% of all internet users. I know people in their 70's and 80's using facebook at this point. And while some countries are more skeptical about it, my country has fully embraced it. To the point where "having a website" is a synonym of "having a facebook page". In reality almost all businesses use facebook exclusively(which is a huge problem for people like me who have blocked all facebook services from my network but that's my problem). The only way a competitor could come into existence at this point the way I see it is a complete collapse of facebook as a company(as in bankruptcy). No one will ditch something that is essential to their existence for something that will only drag them down. Look at G+: IMO as a product the execution was absolutely flawless. Yet it's no more.
    replies(2): >>21574220 #>>21575025 #
    6. yitianjian ◴[] No.21574075[source]
    I would hardly consider Amazon as having an OS - but having actual decent mobile website experience and being a service that requires less use than social media probably helps
    replies(3): >>21574157 #>>21574797 #>>21575907 #
    7. s_y_n_t_a_x ◴[] No.21574157{3}[source]
    Amazon sells their own devices with their own version of Android with their own app store. I would consider that their own OS.
    8. wil421 ◴[] No.21574201{3}[source]
    I’m not sure about the mobile app itself. I do know they rebranded messages in Facebook to become Messenger. Basically you had to access private messages inside Messenger.
    9. trophycase ◴[] No.21574220[source]
    G+ was a facebook clone that brought nearly nothing new to the picture and thus no reason to switch so it failed. Pretty simple. TikTok fills the Vine niche and then some.
    10. toast0 ◴[] No.21574797{3}[source]
    Amazon's main apps are probably the store app and the Kindle app. The store app isn't very useful unless you have the ability to pay over the internet and the ability to have packages delivered; you probably shouldn't be in a country subject to US trade sanctions either.

    The Kindle app may not require ability to pay via the internet, but it helps. There's also a big step to wanting to read.

    Neither of these apps are going to hit the numbers that mostly non paid communications apps will hit, because of the difference in markets.

    11. dehrmann ◴[] No.21574999{3}[source]
    No, it was split out from the main app: https://www.vox.com/2014/8/7/11629664/facebook-messenger-spl...

    > The move allows Facebook developers to focus more exclusively on features and improvements for each individual app. Of course, it also requires users to download another Facebook property onto their smartphones, a not-so-subtle way for the company to increase app downloads.

    I found this on Beluga, but it smells of an acquihire and rewrite, and predates the split by a few years: https://www.adweek.com/digital/beluga-facebook-messenger/

    replies(1): >>21578547 #
    12. toast0 ◴[] No.21575025[source]
    Competition in this space is clearly possible, or we wouldn't be discussing TikTok.

    New to the Internet and young people have less qualms about trying things and are often able to spread things with word of mouth.

    Google plus got mired down in the real name policy and the account consolidation and the usually problems associated with Google (which includes an association with Google).

    13. tinyhouse ◴[] No.21575036[source]
    Worth noting that these are apps you have to download to use. You don't need to download the Reddit app for example to use Reddit.
    14. koonsolo ◴[] No.21575045[source]
    I knew teenagers weren't on Facebook anymore, so I asked my niece what she uses with her friends: WhatsApp groups and Instagram.

    Then I realized how good Facebook knows its market.

    replies(1): >>21575120 #
    15. tinyhouse ◴[] No.21575120[source]
    You can say that about Instagram but not really WhatsApp. When FB acquired WhatsApp it was already the most popular messaging app in many countries. In Israel for example literally every person in the country had WhatsApp on their phone by the time of the acquisition. FB acquiring WhatsApp wasn't that impressive. The impressive part was the amount of money there were willing to pay for it. As far as I know it's still not making any money so it's not even clear yet if it was worth it.
    replies(1): >>21582996 #
    16. bertil ◴[] No.21575907{3}[source]
    I would agree with you although I’m not sure what this has to do with my original comment.

    On Amazon’s scale, there’s a very common mistake made by people in the 11 countries where Amazon delivers (out of a possible 192): they don’t realise that Amazon is actually hardly available internationally. They can’t have a billion users because they don’t serve countries with more than 800M inhabitants.

    AWS is a different story but it’s B2B. And I think that Amazon (Prime) Video is available more widely but Amazon, for all it’s Revenue and Market share isn’t a billion-user company.

    17. skinnymuch ◴[] No.21575946{3}[source]
    Beluuga was a pretty basic app. Sure they acquired that. But Messenger is mostly and created by Facebook. Especially because Facebook Chat was already around.
    18. justapassenger ◴[] No.21576182[source]
    Instagram was small app for hipsters, and everyone thought Facebook was crazy to pay $1B for it.

    They weren’t a competition by any means, and would (speculation) most likely die if they didn’t tap into Facebook resources.

    WhatsApp was only real big competition Facebook bought so far.

    replies(1): >>21577973 #
    19. mgalgs ◴[] No.21577442[source]
    I'm forced to use messenger for work but have refused to download the mobile app for this reason. Voting with my download count.
    replies(1): >>21578917 #
    20. adjkant ◴[] No.21577973{3}[source]
    > They weren’t a competition by any means, and would (speculation) most likely die if they didn’t tap into Facebook resources

    What's your reasoning for that? I think pre-WhatsApp acquisition most people would argue that Facebook would have died if it did not acquire Instagram...

    21. mhluongo ◴[] No.21578547{4}[source]
    The article you posted is about how Beluga was turned into Messenger...
    22. DelTaco ◴[] No.21578638[source]
    To be fair, I've downloaded Messenger like 6 times this year because they prevent you from using the messaging capabilities of Facebook in a mobile browser - even if you request the desktop site.

    So sometimes I'll have to download it when I don't have access to a desktop, send or read a message I needed to, and then uninstall it.

    replies(1): >>21579393 #
    23. baron_harkonnen ◴[] No.21578683[source]
    At lot of comments in these threads fear-mongering about China, but if it weren't for a powerful government asserting that FB, etc cannot acquire ByteDance and the like, then 5/5 would be FB owned. This space only has competition because China aggressively enforces it.

    The US government is basically run from corporate interest, which has served people well for 50 years when things are good. But those corporations have no loyalty to the US. As political and economics interests shift, expect those large corporations to follow there own interests, not those of any nation.

    The Chinese government, for all of its many faults, is making sure that Chinese corporations serve the interest of China. Corporations currently located in the US no longer even pay lip service to being interested in supporting the people of United States.

    24. farisjarrah ◴[] No.21578917{3}[source]
    Ouch, forced to use Facebook for work... Thats rough... My last company ALMOST used Facebook for enterprise like 3 years ago when they were advertising it... So glad it was a flaming pile of garbage when we tested it out.
    replies(1): >>21579263 #
    25. mgalgs ◴[] No.21579263{4}[source]
    > Ouch, forced to use Facebook for work... Thats rough...

    Yeah the worst part is that I can't tell my boss to screw off because it's my company :D We do some customer support on Facebook because so many of our users are there, otherwise I wouldn't be touching it with a 12 foot pole either.

    26. durzagott ◴[] No.21579393[source]
    You can use mbasic.facebook.com to see an low-bandwith version of Facebook. From there you can view and reply to messages without having to install the Messenger app.
    27. Lammy ◴[] No.21581094[source]
    > They also lied and said you had a message when you really didn’t. Just to force the messenger download.

    I bet the line of reasoning is that the message notification is for the upsell telling you how great Messenger is.

    28. zeerev ◴[] No.21582996{3}[source]
    How do they meet other people online now? Those platforms aren't really conductive to creating new friendships. It seems like you'd already need most of that somewhere else. Where are they getting it?
    replies(1): >>21584112 #
    29. koonsolo ◴[] No.21584112{4}[source]
    As far as I can tell, Discord.