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Stripe Chargeback Protection

(stripe.com)
341 points shedside | 13 comments | 03 Jun 19 11:19 UTC | HN request time: 0.225s | source | bottom
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jasonkester ◴[03 Jun 19 11:36 UTC] No.20082119[source]▶
But this isn't the product I want.

I don't want to ever fight chargebacks. Because my policy is to never take money from people who don't want to give it to me. I want to automatically refund every chargeback attempt without it affecting my ability to charge credit cards.

One of my businesses targets consumers, who have this amazing ability to "forget to cancel" or to have "cancelled 3 months ago, but for some reason we're still billing them" or to just plain decide that the last six months of charges were fraudulent and that their bank should get them reversed.

All of that is fine with me, and in fact every invoice I send out says as much: We'll happily refund every penny you ever paid us if you simply ask. But lots of people aren't comfortable asking for their money back. They are, however, plenty comfortable asking their bank to ask for their money back.

I just want a way to streamline that process that doesn't involve me having to handle fighting disputes that I'd prefer to lose. And of course to not have those lost "disputes" count against me.

Any ideas on how to do that, Stripe?

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wayoutthere ◴[03 Jun 19 12:03 UTC] No.20082259[source]▶
Unless you have an easily visible telephone support number, I’m issuing a chargeback. It simply takes less of my time and idgaf about your business model.
replies(3): >>20082271 #>>20082502 #>>20082549 #
1. jasonkester ◴[03 Jun 19 12:06 UTC] No.20082271[source]▶
Isn't that harder than replying to your last invoice mail with the words "Please refund this and cancel my subscription"?

Why involve the telephone?

replies(5): >>20082337 #>>20082351 #>>20082368 #>>20082388 #>>20082402 #
2. organsnyder ◴[03 Jun 19 12:16 UTC] No.20082337[source]▶
I think many people have been conditioned to assume that replying to automated messages goes straight to /dev/null. Have you considered putting a link to a page that provides a quick cancellation workflow?
replies(1): >>20082386 #
3. wayoutthere ◴[03 Jun 19 12:17 UTC] No.20082351[source]▶
You’re assuming there is an invoice; many times there is not which is why the chargeback is auto-approved.

For better or worse, the chargeback is the only weapon end-users have anymore.

replies(1): >>20084679 #
4. MichaelApproved ◴[03 Jun 19 12:20 UTC] No.20082368[source]▶
You know that bullshit "no-reply@lazy-company-with-garbage-customer-service.com" email that many companies use as the sender for communications? Too many don't even bother to name the no-reply account as that but essentially send from a no-reply address.

So, does your reply reach them? Who knows. Now you have to set yourself a reminder to follow up and make sure the request got through.

Alternatively, you hunt down their support email but you still need to follow up.

Then there are the rare times a company fights you on it. Then you have a whole back and forth before they finally capitulate.

I personally go through the hassle but I can understand why OP wouldn't want to.

5. jasonkester ◴[03 Jun 19 12:23 UTC] No.20082386[source]▶
Here's one of those invoice mails in its entirety. Sent from (and reply-to) info@twiddla.com. See if you can figure out how to go about cancelling your subscription or getting a refund:

Your Twiddla Bill for April 4, 2019 to May 4, 2019

Hey, we wanted to let you know that on May 4, 2019 we charged your credit card $14.00 for your monthly Twiddla Pro subscription.

You can find additional information regarding your bill, individual charges, and your account history by logging into your your account at https://www.twiddla.com/ and navigating to your "My Account" page. You can also make changes to your subscription or cancel it altogether from that page.

If you have any questions regarding this charge, or would like to yell at us until we refund it, please contact us at info@twiddla.com.

Thanks for the business!

Jason Kester

info@twiddla.com

https://www.twiddla.com/

replies(1): >>20082945 #
6. derivagral ◴[03 Jun 19 12:24 UTC] No.20082388[source]▶
Not the gp, but in my experience emails like that are usually Do Not Reply.
7. kofejnik ◴[03 Jun 19 12:26 UTC] No.20082402[source]▶
some people (myself included) strongly prefer interacting with live humans, over emailing and hoping that stuff gets fixed. E.g. in McDonalds, rather than ordering in a kiosk, I go to a cashier, it's actually easier and faster this way.
8. ensignavenger ◴[03 Jun 19 13:41 UTC] No.20082945{3}[source]▶
I have no desire to yell at you, simply to cancel the account and request a refund. While sending an email is okay, it would be better if there was a link directly to a page to do so, just like unsubscribing from an email list. Regardless, I would recommend changing the wording from "yell" because that sounds hostile, and most people don't want the conflict.
replies(1): >>20083298 #
9. jasonkester ◴[03 Jun 19 14:17 UTC] No.20083298{4}[source]▶
One nice thing about running your own business is that you can develop your own "voice" throughout the copy on your site and in your communication with users. And that that voice need not be soulless nor corporate nor cleared by Legal.

Plenty of people have taken me up on the offer for a refund, and none of them felt the need to "yell", so I think they got the correct vibe. All our site copy and mails have this same casual, friendly tone. People seem to like it.

replies(2): >>20084271 #>>20084909 #
10. ensignavenger ◴[03 Jun 19 15:34 UTC] No.20084271{5}[source]▶
I understand wanting to have your own style. I am not opposed to the casual tone. You were complaining that some customers don't take you up on the offer, and instead contact their banks to request a charge back. I was suggesting that changing that one word (but not necessarily the casual tone) might make a difference in encouraging some of those people. But it is your business, you can try the suggestion or not, I apologize if my comment came across as pushy or anything like that.
11. dexterdog ◴[03 Jun 19 16:04 UTC] No.20084679[source]▶
That's utter nonsense. Most reasonable companies will offer you a refund if you simply ask, especially if you haven't used the service or incurred any costs for the company because of your failure to cancel. When you sign up for a monthly service it is not the company's responsibility to make sure you want to continue each month. Some still do, but it is not required.
replies(1): >>20084917 #
12. quelltext ◴[03 Jun 19 16:20 UTC] No.20084909{5}[source]▶
The people who did end up writing in are not your problem though, are they? It's the ones who don't. I wouldn't base my experience on the ones who cooperated.

Casual tone is one thing (a good thing), but I posit that an actually angry customer will not respond well to this.

"Oh damn I get this email again... and they are telling me I can cancel, but I think I already cancelled... wth. Hmm, maybe they'll give me a refund."

Now at that point whether the customer is right or wrong they'll read the yell part and think that you are mocking their potential interest in demanding a refund.

Maybe I am totally alone here (with the other guy I guess), but while I wouldn't go dispute a charge myself that wording of yours would not encourage me to write in and get my hopes up you are happy to accomodate me.

13. wayoutthere ◴[03 Jun 19 16:21 UTC] No.20084917{3}[source]▶
Right, but if cancellation becomes a dark pattern, use a dark pattern in response.