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370 points sillypuddy | 1 comments | | HN request time: 0s | source
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twblalock ◴[] No.16408620[source]
I don't get it. I grew up in Silicon Valley and I work in tech, and so do many other people I know. They run the gamut from far-left socialists to libertarians to own a bunch of guns. They have all kinds of ethnic backgrounds and religious views.

Some of my most libertarian/pro-gun friends have not been shy about their political views and it hasn't hurt their tech careers at all. They are far more welcome here than liberals are in other parts of the country.

It seems to me, from personal experience, that the people who feel alienated are the ones who bring politics to work in an overbearing contrarian way, seeking to cause offense under the guise of "debate," and then pretend to be shocked when people don't want to put up with their shit. Work is for working; it's not a debating society, and especially not when the debating is done in bad faith.

Peter Thiel has been more politically vocal than most, and he is vocal about things he knows to be unpopular. He can't be surprised that people who disagree with him are also vocal. If he can't take the heat he should stay out of the kitchen.

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dcow ◴[] No.16408994[source]
From my perspective, it's the culture that develops around the "liberal politics" that is the issue. I don't think anyone is complaining about "getting heat for political views". I mean that's just politics. What I've experienced at various companies, though, is that the culture becomes infected with the politics to a point where it impacts the way companies operate and even individual employees' ability to perform their job at a capacity that can produce value. This is where I think it crosses the line. Effectively, companies or individuals end up handicapped by the political agenda. And that makes zero sense rationally for the business. It's literally not their business to be in politics.

I'm hesitant to share anecdotes so I'll keep them fuzzy, but a few things I've seen are along the lines of places removing a comedic joke item because it /might/ give a newcomer the impression that the place "normalizes fascism" (rationale was fear someone wouldn't understand it's a joke and thus let's err on the side of keeping the space sterile), and hiring/comp policies designed around explicitly not paying men more than woman for the same role (everyone's the same role when your company doesn't have roles...) regardless of experience, performance, market, etc. at the expense of acquiring or retaining outstanding talent. And look what happened at Google...

It all comes from good intentions, but IMO it really just misses the mark and reduces an otherwise complex and human landscape to arbitrary statistics and n=1 anecdotes. There is very little intellectual rigor, or proven methodology and a lot of pandering to the political atmosphere (and this happens at places juggling millions of dollars of investor capital). On top of that, I don't understand why the office needs to be the place to explore these issues. If there are objectively systemic issues and discrepancies between e.g. genders in the US today that need correction, then we need to solve those with government policy and social activism. And if our society and our system of government does not respond, perhaps you just have to grow up realize that despite your self-endowed intellectual infallibility, some other people disagree and you might be barking up the wrong tree. Or, don't concede and keep fighting for justice, but don't bring it to work because you're too impatient or lack the perseverance to see your issue through at local, state, and national levels.

So even if other areas might have (for the sake of the argument), on average, more jerks that just don't get it or have a few things to learn about being inclusive and respectful in the way they conduct their daily lives, people don't build operational business policies around solving the perceived problems or shortcomings (not saying HR departments can't lay ground rules, but I'm talking about operational strategies). And that's the difference between an office in SF and an office in NYC or Boston, or Austin, etc.

I would not be surprised if the fact that people find some of Thiel's politics to be unfavorable is impacting his ability to function professionally in the Bay Area. When people's professional livelihood is at steak, of course they will gravitate towards communities where they are not otherwise encumbered. In the case of Thiel, money seems less of an issue, so I suspect he's also making a social statement about the state of affairs down by the bay. Celebrate or listen, but I hope you choose to listen because talent and money are all SV has got going for it, and if those things leave you can kiss the glory days goodbye.

/2cents

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rgossiaux ◴[] No.16409961[source]
>I'm hesitant to share anecdotes so I'll keep them fuzzy, but a few things I've seen are along the lines of places removing a comedic joke item because it /might/ give a newcomer the impression that the place "normalizes fascism" (rationale was fear someone wouldn't understand it's a joke and thus let's err on the side of keeping the space sterile), and hiring/comp policies designed around explicitly not paying men more than woman for the same role (everyone's the same role when your company doesn't have roles...) regardless of experience, performance, market, etc. at the expense of acquiring or retaining outstanding talent. And look what happened at Google...

You know your situation better than I do, but based on your descriptions I'm with your company on these. You haven't painted a very sympathetic picture of whatever this joke item is, and as for comp, I mean, it seems pretty logical that men and women should be paid the same for the same role, no? That doesn't mean you can't hire/retain talent, you just implement a leveling system like every other company and promote high performers to higher levels.

As for Google, are we talking about the guy who was a dick and caused a massive PR problem and got fired for it? And if your claim is that companies are making bad business decisions and you're pointing at Google, doesn't their 750B market cap undermine the point?

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1. Fins ◴[] No.16411151{3}[source]
You mean the guy who did what Google wanted him to do -- wrote a reasonably thoughtful essay on a subject that Google had company-wide training on and requested feedback about; had his essay leaked to the outside world, received theats of physical violence (those people are still employed, I believe), and then had himself fired over something that wasn't even in his memo? That guy?

As for Google having a huge market cap, isn't it a a rather common liberal/left-wing trope that uch great wealth comes from being evil?