←back to thread

Ask a Female Engineer: Thoughts on the Google Memo

(blog.ycombinator.com)
1080 points cbcowans | 5 comments | 15 Aug 17 19:19 UTC | HN request time: 0s | source
Show context
hedgew ◴[15 Aug 17 19:57 UTC] No.15021772[source]▶
Many of the more reasonable criticisms of the memo say that it wasn't written well enough; it could've been more considerate, it should have used better language, or better presentation. In this particular link, Scott Alexander is used as an example of better writing, and he certainly is one of the best and most persuasive modern writers I've found. However, I can not imagine ever matching his talent and output, even if I practiced for years to try and catch up.

I do not think that anyone's ability to write should disbar them from discussion. We can not expect perfection from others. Instead we should try to understand them as human beings, and interpret them with generosity and kindness.

replies(31): >>15021858 #>>15021871 #>>15021893 #>>15021907 #>>15021914 #>>15021963 #>>15021998 #>>15022264 #>>15022369 #>>15022372 #>>15022389 #>>15022448 #>>15022883 #>>15022898 #>>15022932 #>>15022997 #>>15023149 #>>15023177 #>>15023435 #>>15023742 #>>15023755 #>>15023819 #>>15023909 #>>15024938 #>>15025044 #>>15025144 #>>15025251 #>>15026052 #>>15026111 #>>15027621 #>>15028052 #
frik ◴[16 Aug 17 04:30 UTC] No.15024938[source]▶
Interesting is that all Google related news (in the last two weeks) got flagged/hidden ("it's the algorithm", "it's the user", blabla). And now HN had time to post their own opinion piece - this one stays.
replies(1): >>15025303 #
dang ◴[16 Aug 17 06:13 UTC] No.15025303[source]▶
That's false and nasty. You've made up so many groundless insinuations against us over so many years that at some point I'm just going to give up and ban you; I don't think it's reasonable to expect patience with false accusations to be infinite.

In the meantime, here are three comments that explain how moderators had nothing to do with this.

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15023538

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15023498

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15023486

replies(2): >>15025845 #>>15028353 #
jblow ◴[16 Aug 17 08:29 UTC] No.15025845[source]▶
I don't think it's false and nasty. I was thinking the same thing ... quite objectively. There were at least two discussions that I thought were very reasonable, and they got flagged into oblivion very quickly. So I don't know why the YC link gets to be the exception. It feels wrong.

Maybe it is due to the users, but if that is so, it feels wrong enough to give me a pretty big loss of faith in the dynamics of the community.

replies(2): >>15025876 #>>15031086 #
jblow ◴[16 Aug 17 08:35 UTC] No.15025876{3}[source]▶
It occurs to me, maybe this is another instance of the left engaging in silencing tactics and maybe that is a weakness in the flagging algorithm.

I can't vote "don't flag this". So if there are approximately two sides to a discussion, and one side wants to flag it to silence the discussion, then the discussion is going to get flagged no matter what.

So the side that wants to silence just selectively silences the opinions they don't agree with, and they win.

replies(4): >>15026567 #>>15027667 #>>15031946 #>>15039702 #
1. 21 ◴[16 Aug 17 11:16 UTC] No.15026567{4}[source]▶
Upvotes are considered "don't flag this". See https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15023498

The silencing happens because there is a huge left/right discrepancy on this site and because silencing your opposition became acceptable, due to victimhood culture.

One thing I would be very curios to know is the age distribution of people advocating silencing and no platforming.

I suspect that younger people support this due to the helicopter parent style they were more likely to have grew with, where the parent suppresses anything discomforting for the child instead of letting the child deal with it on it's own. So when that child grows it's normal for him to demand 'the state' or 'the corporation' to do the same thing, because only his comfort and views matter.

replies(1): >>15030984 #
2. dang ◴[16 Aug 17 20:18 UTC] No.15030984[source]▶
If you look at the full range of such 'discrepancies' people report perceiving on this site, it's unmistakeable that they are in the eye of the beholder. Each side says HN is dominated by the opposite site. It's a cognitive bias: the comments you dislike stand out more and seem more prominent than the ones you like, leading to the impression that the community is against you. Both sides feel this way (see https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15027667, in the same thread!) and the irony is that the impression gets stronger, not weaker, the closer the community is to evenly divided.
replies(1): >>15031451 #
3. 21 ◴[16 Aug 17 21:17 UTC] No.15031451[source]▶
You don't typically comment, so I'm unsure if I should consider this as some sort of a (pre?) warning.

I'm a leftist. But what I see right now on the left deeply concerns me and makes me reconsider, stuff like black people advocating black only areas or events, which is ironic, because in the 60 they were fighting exactly against this, or leftists justifying and advocating violence against the extreme right, using the all time favorite excuse that "bad people deserve to be beaten".

FWIW I also got the impression that certain kinds of articles quickly disappear from the front page, and you can see on them more comments than upvotes, which is in general unusual and which suggests heavy downvoting. So to me it doesn't appear that the community is balanced. Which is not to say that this is a bad thing, many times some views are better than others.

replies(2): >>15031977 #>>15044141 #
4. AnimalMuppet ◴[16 Aug 17 22:46 UTC] No.15031977{3}[source]▶
[cough] Well, some of us rightists aren't very impressed by what we see lately on the right, either...
5. dang ◴[18 Aug 17 07:03 UTC] No.15044141{3}[source]▶
I didn't intend the comment as a warning. Note that the word 'please' did not appear :)

No, it's really just that this misperception is so universal that I can't help but answer it even though I know it will do no good. Maybe it's a Beckett play.