←back to thread

1080 points cbcowans | 3 comments | | HN request time: 1.189s | source
Show context
hedgew ◴[] No.15021772[source]
Many of the more reasonable criticisms of the memo say that it wasn't written well enough; it could've been more considerate, it should have used better language, or better presentation. In this particular link, Scott Alexander is used as an example of better writing, and he certainly is one of the best and most persuasive modern writers I've found. However, I can not imagine ever matching his talent and output, even if I practiced for years to try and catch up.

I do not think that anyone's ability to write should disbar them from discussion. We can not expect perfection from others. Instead we should try to understand them as human beings, and interpret them with generosity and kindness.

replies(31): >>15021858 #>>15021871 #>>15021893 #>>15021907 #>>15021914 #>>15021963 #>>15021998 #>>15022264 #>>15022369 #>>15022372 #>>15022389 #>>15022448 #>>15022883 #>>15022898 #>>15022932 #>>15022997 #>>15023149 #>>15023177 #>>15023435 #>>15023742 #>>15023755 #>>15023819 #>>15023909 #>>15024938 #>>15025044 #>>15025144 #>>15025251 #>>15026052 #>>15026111 #>>15027621 #>>15028052 #
joe_the_user ◴[] No.15021907[source]
I'd actually say just the opposite - the memo seemed to be written as well and in as conciliatory manner as it could be written and the memo made good (or at least plausible) point and bad points. But the bad points were so bad that it was appropriate and necessary to fire Damore.

Essentially, as analogy, there's no way for a person to say "Black people are inferior and shouldn't be hired", as a message broadcast through their entire workplace, and not have that person be creating a hostile work environment for African Americans. If that person says "I don't mean in general, I mean inferior just for this occupation, I don't mean inferior, just 'differently talented, they've got great rhythm'", it doesn't matter, if that person says "here's a study which says this, we should consider this in an open minded fashion" it doesn't matter. The message is unacceptable. That person is done, that person should be done.

replies(13): >>15021984 #>>15022012 #>>15022025 #>>15022035 #>>15022047 #>>15022101 #>>15022180 #>>15022225 #>>15022271 #>>15022321 #>>15024376 #>>15025796 #>>15026104 #
Udik ◴[] No.15022012[source]
Again, like many others you are confusing "less people from this group are qualified" with "people from this group are less qualified". The first doesn't say anything about single individuals, and doesn't suggest any discriminatory practice against the group. The second does.
replies(3): >>15022036 #>>15022055 #>>15022152 #
dguaraglia ◴[] No.15022152[source]
One of the women in the article addresses that very aptly:

> Assuming that it’s true that women on average are more likely to have trait X, why should any woman have to overcome the additional barrier of proving that she’s not like other women, or that if she IS like other women, that the trait has no bearing on her job performance?

Creating a stereotype generates distrust in the individuals that are part of the group described by the stereotype. You yourself had to delve on the wording of the phrase to explain why you think it's different. Do you think the average person would put as much thought on the wording?

replies(2): >>15022223 #>>15022245 #
1. Uhhrrr ◴[] No.15022245[source]
99% of humanity wouldn't get hired at Google, male or female. As long as the hiring bar is kept high enough, there's no reason for Google employees to especially distrust women over men.
replies(1): >>15022431 #
2. mempko ◴[] No.15022431[source]
And yet, this is my opinion, the software quality could be a lot better at google. For example google docs was broken in Firefox for over a day for me. Google Maps crashes on certain routes preventing me getting a route. Whatever they are doing isn't enough. Also the UX at google is a mess.
replies(1): >>15022723 #
3. mantas ◴[] No.15022723[source]
Sometimes poor UX seem to be for a reason. Be it Facebook or Google, I feel like extorted product rather than the user. I wish someone created a search engine that I could pay for.