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288 points fernandotakai | 1 comments | | HN request time: 0s | source
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userbinator ◴[] No.10040344[source]
Mozilla's hypocrisy is astounding:

https://blog.mozilla.org/security/2013/01/29/putting-users-i...

"Users should have the choice of what software and plugins run on their machine."

https://blog.mozilla.org/theden/2014/12/15/introducing-a-sma...

"Firefox is dedicated to putting users in control of their online experience"

More recently:

https://blog.mozilla.org/blog/2015/06/02/firefox-puts-you-in...

"Firefox Puts You in Control of Your Online Life".

The slogan, as found on https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/new/ , is now "Firefox is created by a global non-profit dedicated to putting individuals in control online." I believe it used to be "users" - see above - but was silently changed. I suppose these "individuals" are the people at Mozilla...?

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soapdog ◴[] No.10041265[source]
WTF people. So much hate for Mozilla these days, this appear pitchfork group.

Lets review what the article says: addons needed to be signed. The process is automated. It takes only seconds. It prevents some malware from spreading.

You can still host your addon wherever you want. This is just an extra step that can actually improve security. It requires more effort by the part of the developer but it also helps prevent some security issues.

Firefox Dev Edition and Nightly will have switches to turn this off. Firefox stable and Beta will not. Do you want to switch this off? Move to more bleeding edge versions. Or pick the unbranded version.

The unbranded version is available only in English and this is a problem that can be solved with language packs which are available in the hundreds.

Heck, this is an improvement to security. You can opt out by moving to a different Firefox version, there are three versions you can use, DevEdition, Nightly and Unbranded. If you opt-in you have an extra level of confidence in the addon you're installing.

Developers take only couple seconds to submit and retrieve back their addons and the added bonus for security is great. This will prevent those pesky spyware/malware from hijacking your browser which is a problem faced by many users that are not as tech savvy as this crowd here.

And yet people throw a tantrum....

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SkatAndRap ◴[] No.10042924[source]
It's not "hatred" you're seeing. It's exasperation after repeated disappointment, so much of it totally unnecessary.

Many of us have been using software from Mozilla, and Netscape before them, for decades now. Generally we've been happy with the software. We were more than happy with earlier versions of Firefox, in fact. But lately we've seen changes made that have not benefited the users of Mozilla's software.

Your comment actually describes some of the problems we're talking about. Users and developers now have to jump through one hoop after another just to get a basic installation of Firefox working.

It wasn't always like that. We used to be able to download a sub-10 MB installer, run it, and have a usable installation of Firefox ready for use.

Now we have to choose from the "correct" stream, download a 40 MB or larger installer, run it, change numerous about:config options to allow us to install our own custom unsigned extensions and to disable unwanted functionality that Mozilla has added, manually remove unwanted toolbar buttons, install a number of third-party extensions that also fix additional problems introduced by Mozilla, and in the end we're still stuck with a user interface and a user experience that isn't very good.

Now if we're developing extensions, we'll have to also jump through more hoops thanks to this signing process. You say it "takes only seconds", but I've seen enough comments here from other developers saying they've been waiting months for reviews. That's not acceptable.

Firefox used to get better with each release. A new release of Firefox was something we'd look forward to. But lately, each new release of Firefox has brought us new problems to deal with, without bringing any notable improvements.

Repeatedly disappointed people will express their disappointment. Don't misinterpret it as "hatred". See it for what it is: disappointment!

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soapdog ◴[] No.10045854{3}[source]
Thanks for keeping it civil. I will address some of your comments in the best way I can.

>It wasn't always like that. We used to be able to download a sub-10 MB installer, run it, and have a usable installation of Firefox ready for use.

The Web Platform advanced a lot in the last few years. A lot has been added to browsers. They are no longer a simple HTML engine with some CSS and bad JS engines. Browsers these days are almost their own operating systems for good and bad. They have so much stuff going on between all the multimedia features, multiple JS engines and compilers, there are lots of stuff going on. Browsers are larger because the Web grew a lot (not in the sense of size but in complexity)

> Now we have to choose from the "correct" stream, download a 40 MB or larger installer, run it, change numerous about:config options to allow us to install our own custom unsigned extensions and to disable unwanted functionality that Mozilla has added, manually remove unwanted toolbar buttons, install a number of third-party extensions that also fix additional problems introduced by Mozilla, and in the end we're still stuck with a user interface and a user experience that isn't very good.

Firefox has always been customizable and the about:config feature enables lots of under the hood tweaks that are not possible everywhere. Making Firefox your own its part of what makes it great. Its a browser you can change to suit your needs, thats less common than people think. Your needs are not the same needs of others. As for running your unsigned extension, there will be six versions of Firefox available (stable, unbranded stable, beta, unbranded beta, dev edition and nightly). Of these six, only two will force addon signing. All the others are a tweak away.

> Now if we're developing extensions, we'll have to also jump through more hoops thanks to this signing process. You say it "takes only seconds", but I've seen enough comments here from other developers saying they've been waiting months for reviews. That's not acceptable.

Please don't mix addon signing with AMO review, they are different process with different objectives. Addon signing happens in seconds because its automated. The signed addon is returned to you in seconds and you're free to distribute it as you see fit. Now, if you want to have your addon on AMO then you need to submit to AMO review which may take a long time due to the lack of people and the overall complexity of reviewing that type of code.

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1. ectoplasm ◴[] No.10045875{4}[source]
> As for running your unsigned extension, there will be six versions of Firefox available (stable, unbranded stable, beta, unbranded beta, dev edition and nightly). Of these six, only two will force addon signing. All the others are a tweak away.

Okay, I want a branded Firefox. I don't want to run a dev edition or nightly. My choices are stable or beta. I probably don't even want beta, but it doesn't really matter. So, I don't really have a choice here.

I can see why signed extensions are a good thing, but removing the option from about:config is unnecessary.