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The last-ever penny will be minted today in Philadelphia

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349 points andrewl | 6 comments | 12 Nov 25 16:10 UTC | HN request time: 1.089s | source | bottom
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Amorymeltzer ◴[12 Nov 25 18:05 UTC] No.45903482[source]▶
Some interesting complications with rounding I had not heard about before were mentioned here, worth noting I think, especially given the prominence of SNAP in the news lately:

>Four states - Delaware, Connecticut, Michigan and Oregon - as well as numerous cities, including New York, Philadelphia, Miami and Washington, DC, require merchants to provide exact change, according to the National Association of Convenience Stores (NACS).

>In addition, the law covering the federal food assistance program known as SNAP requires that recipients not be charged more than other customers. Since SNAP recipients use a debit card that’s charged the precise amount, if merchants round down prices for cash purchases, they could be opening themselves to legal problems and fines, said Jeff Lenard, spokesperson for NACS.

>“Rounding down on all transactions presents several challenges beyond the loss of an average of 2 cents per transaction,” Lenard said. “We desperately need legislation that allows rounding so retailers can make change for these customers.”

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nofriend ◴[12 Nov 25 18:16 UTC] No.45903663[source]▶
just make the price a multiple of five cents
replies(1): >>45903695 #
mattnewton ◴[12 Nov 25 18:18 UTC] No.45903695[source]▶
State and local taxes make this infeasible
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1. hollasch ◴[12 Nov 25 18:29 UTC] No.45903884[source]▶
It's just American custom to exclude some taxes from the posted price. Many countries include all taxes in the price, something I've always wished we would do in America. After that, I'd love to see the elimination of the custom of always ending fuel cost per gallon in 9/10 of a cent.
replies(1): >>45904164 #
2. smallerize ◴[12 Nov 25 18:46 UTC] No.45904164[source]▶
Rounding sales tax on each item will often result in a different price than rounding once for the total. The store will collect the wrong amount of tax that way.
replies(2): >>45904638 #>>45906470 #
3. estimator7292 ◴[12 Nov 25 19:09 UTC] No.45904638[source]▶
Come on, this is not complicated. It's elementary algebra. You sum the rounded prices, then add a credit or surcharge of 2 cents to make the tax come out to a round number.

The tax is on the actual, real amount in your transaction subtotal. You are charged sales tax on the actual, real money you pay for the entire transaction. Then you multiply by 1.06 or whatever the tax rate is. That's how sales tax works.

If one rearranges the equations as we all learned in 5th grade, one can compute the amount that the subtotal must be to get a round number after tax. Then you charge or credit the customer the difference.

Alternatively, the retailer can simply pay the 4 cent difference in sales tax.

That's it. You either do algebra or just pay the difference. It is not complicated.

replies(1): >>45905134 #
4. mattnewton ◴[12 Nov 25 19:35 UTC] No.45905134{3}[source]▶
You have to do this algebra per state and locale, and your reward is higher advertised prices than the shop next door. I think you both underestimate the problem and overestimate everyone involved in retail, especially the consumer.

I’m not saying it’s hard, I’m saying there is enough friction where it’s just not going to happen without legislation mandating it.

replies(1): >>45905476 #
5. metabagel ◴[12 Nov 25 19:55 UTC] No.45905476{4}[source]▶
> it’s just not going to happen without legislation mandating it.

Obviously, and I don't think anyone said otherwise.

6. rtkwe ◴[12 Nov 25 20:51 UTC] No.45906470[source]▶
They're saying include the sales tax in the price and set the item's price such that the sum of price + all taxes is an even increment of 5 cents. Gets a little tricky with fractional sales taxes but that's only a problem where POS systems strictly enforce 2 digit cents (not sure if that's the case).