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Futurelock: A subtle risk in async Rust

(rfd.shared.oxide.computer)
427 points bcantrill | 2 comments | 31 Oct 25 16:49 UTC | HN request time: 0.416s | source

This RFD describes our distillation of a really gnarly issue that we hit in the Oxide control plane.[0] Not unlike our discovery of the async cancellation issue[1][2][3], this is larger than the issue itself -- and worse, the program that hits futurelock is correct from the programmer's point of view. Fortunately, the surface area here is smaller than that of async cancellation and the conditions required to hit it can be relatively easily mitigated. Still, this is a pretty deep issue -- and something that took some very seasoned Rust hands quite a while to find.

[0] https://github.com/oxidecomputer/omicron/issues/9259

[1] https://rfd.shared.oxide.computer/rfd/397

[2] https://rfd.shared.oxide.computer/rfd/400

[3] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zrv5Cy1R7r4

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Sytten ◴[31 Oct 25 20:21 UTC] No.45776277[source]▶
I am wondering if there is a larger RFC for Rust to force users to not hold a variable across await points.

In my mind futurelock is similar to keeping a sync lock across an await point. We have nothing right now to force a drop and I think the solution to that problem would help here.

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cogman10 ◴[31 Oct 25 20:37 UTC] No.45776433[source]▶
The ideas that have been batted around is called "async drop" [1]

And it looks like it's still just an unaddressed well known problem [2].

Honestly, once the Mozilla sackening of rust devs happened it seems like the language has been practically rudderless. The RFC system seems almost dead as a lot of the main contributors are no longer working on rust.

This initiative hasn't had motion since 2021. [3]

[1] https://rust-lang.github.io/async-fundamentals-initiative/ro...

[2] https://rust-lang.github.io/async-fundamentals-initiative/

[3] https://github.com/rust-lang/async-fundamentals-initiative

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raggi ◴[31 Oct 25 20:48 UTC] No.45776530[source]▶
Those pages are out of date, and AsyncDrop is in progress: https://github.com/rust-lang/rust/issues/126482

I think "practically rudderless" here is fairly misinformed and a little harmful/rude to all the folks doing tons of great work still.

It's a shame there are some stale pages around and so on, but they're not good measures of the state of the project or ecosystem.

The problem of holding objects across async points is also partially implemented in this unstable lint marker which is used by some projects: https://dev-doc.rust-lang.org/unstable-book/language-feature...

You also get a similar effect in multi-threaded runtimes by not arbitrarily making everything in your object model Send and instead designing your architecture so that most things between wake-ups don't become arbitrarily movable references.

These aren't perfect mitigations, but some tools.

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1. bigstrat2003 ◴[31 Oct 25 21:05 UTC] No.45776684[source]▶
In fairness, if you're a layman to the rust development process (as I am, so I'm speaking from personal experience here) it's damn near impossible to figure out the status of things. There tracking issues, RFCs, etc which is very confusing as an outsider and gives no obvious place to look to find out the current status of a proposal. I'm sure there is a logic to it and that if I spent the time to learn it would make sense. But it is really hard to approach for someone like me.
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2. kibwen ◴[01 Nov 25 13:34 UTC] No.45781525[source]▶
If you want to find out the status of something, the best bet is to go to the Rust Zulip and ask around: https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com/ . Most Rust initiatives are pushed forward by volunteers who are happy to talk about what they're working on, but who only periodically write status reports on tracking issues (usually in response to someone asking them what the status is). Rust isn't a company where documentation is anyone's job, it's just a bunch of people working on stuff, for better or worse.