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Falling panel prices lead to global solar boom, except for the US

(arstechnica.com)
249 points Jtsummers | 28 comments | 30 Oct 25 16:32 UTC | HN request time: 1.082s | source | bottom
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mmooss ◴[30 Oct 25 17:14 UTC] No.45762412[source]▶
As I wrote elsewhere, the US government and economy are now essentially a private equity takeover for a large segment of wealthy business: Squeeze out as much money as possible short term - including by issuing debt againts its assets, slashing and burning any costs regardless of ROI and with no regard for the future, and leave the bankrupt husk for someone else to deal with.

The treatment of fossil fuels and renewables fits: Block the obviously more economical and better long-term solution in order to shovel money toward the entrenched wealthy. That it sabotages the future due to climate change and economic inefficiency doesn't seem to be a significant factor to them.

I forgot, one of the entrenched corporate wealthy told us that climate change isn't a big deal, and we should send money to his and his friends for solutions.

I'm not anti-business; in fact, quite the opposite: These policies block a free market and the brilliant new businesses that can thrive and deliver solutions to everyone.

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seanmcdirmid ◴[30 Oct 25 17:17 UTC] No.45762459[source]▶
If only Musk didn't turn out to be such a twitt, Tesla was really supposed to be part of the solution but somehow Musk managed to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory.

The future is pretty much in China now as far as green energy tech and consumption goes. Two bad elections and the US has basically lost world leader status in just over a decade.

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bigyabai ◴[30 Oct 25 17:31 UTC] No.45762653[source]▶
Musk chronically over-promised and terminally under-delivered. There was no world where he didn't end up being a twit, just one where we aren't stupid enough to fall for his lies.

Tesla, in particular, boils down to how Americans respond to marketing. We love the idea of buying organic, environmentally-friendly technology that makes us part of the solution. It doesn't matter if Congolese children are dying in the cobalt mines to make EV-grade lithium ion batteries, us Americans need to virtue signal with our wallet. Buy the latest iPhone, save up for a Tesla, it's all part of the new-age jewelry we wear to make ourselves feel worth something.

It was damn good marketing.

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1. triceratops ◴[30 Oct 25 17:44 UTC] No.45762826[source]▶
> Americans need to virtue signal with our wallet

The only realistic alternative - not "virtue signalling" and instead buying polluting ICE vehicles - is far worse. I'm ok with virtue signalling. It's not like America is going to get walkable cities and world-class public transit anytime before 2060.

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2. embedding-shape ◴[30 Oct 25 17:58 UTC] No.45762994[source]▶
> It's not like America is going to get walkable cities and world-class public transit anytime before 2060

I wouldn't be so pessimistic! The inevitable swing towards authoritarianism in the US happened much sooner than I expected, which also means it'll swing back again much sooner too, likely to be way before 2060. I'll throw out a prediction and say that the soon-to-be-authoritarian state that is under construction right now might fall as soon as 2035-2040, and it'll be a wild swing the other way once it happens.

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3. nbngeorcjhe ◴[30 Oct 25 18:07 UTC] No.45763097[source]▶
what makes you so sure it'll fall? plenty of autocracies last for decades, or generations
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4. cool_man_bob ◴[30 Oct 25 18:13 UTC] No.45763176[source]▶
Meh, I feel we’re entering an era where only the elite will be able to realistically check authoritarians, and they will just be lesser

Think more of the earlier end of medieval era, where the peasant class was mostly incapable against feudal armies, even in many cases with massive numbers on their side.

There’s an entire surveillance state, eyes everywhere, gait recognition, massive intelligence networks all at a scale unimaginable by kings and dictators of the past.

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5. rchaud ◴[30 Oct 25 18:16 UTC] No.45763224[source]▶
That scenario assumes that history will work the same way it did in the aftermath of WWII. There is no guarantee of that. America could become another Russia, where the collapse of the Soviet Union led to secession of several republics. The new democratic government was too weak to face the challenges of successive financial crises and active civil wars. Eventually power falls back into the hands of s strongman who scales back democratic reforms to maintain power.
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6. davidw ◴[30 Oct 25 18:23 UTC] No.45763325[source]▶
I wouldn't be so pessimistic. Here in Oregon we're working pretty hard at doing that, for instance.

I'm definitely ok with 'virtue signalling' though. It's a lot better than vice signalling.

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7. DonnyV ◴[30 Oct 25 18:24 UTC] No.45763355{3}[source]▶
Incompetence, our "leaders" are woefully incompetent. MAGA, GOP and the right are filled with idiots. The Liberal and Neoliberal Democrats at least were a little better at stealing everything from us and delaying progress. They would bury people in culture wars and keep their followers busy with DEI rules. They used legitimate racist issues and then said everything was caused by racism and not that the 1% was just stealing everything.
8. dylan604 ◴[30 Oct 25 18:32 UTC] No.45763499[source]▶
which part of Oregon is that though? The part that is on fire and suffering from massive insurrection, or the part that wants to secede from the state and become part of Montana? Either way, your optimism seems very out of place. Even if one city makes changes, that doesn't define it as a trend. The rest of the country is not following

edit the embarrassing

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9. dylan604 ◴[30 Oct 25 18:35 UTC] No.45763530{3}[source]▶
Hand Maid's Tale doesn't seem so fictional after all of this in how the divisions would reshape the country
10. dylan604 ◴[30 Oct 25 18:36 UTC] No.45763552{3}[source]▶
The elites are not checking the authoritarians, they're fueling them.
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11. cool_man_bob ◴[30 Oct 25 18:37 UTC] No.45763566{4}[source]▶
For now, those alliances are always tentative through.
12. triceratops ◴[30 Oct 25 18:45 UTC] No.45763688{3}[source]▶
> that wants to succeed [sic] from the state and become part of Montana

If joining Montana is "success" you've set your sights too low

/s (no offence to Montanans, it's a beautiful state. I just couldn't resist)

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13. davidw ◴[30 Oct 25 18:48 UTC] No.45763735{4}[source]▶
They want to 'succeed' in Idaho in any case, not Montana, which does not share a border with Oregon.

I'm also curious about the 'massive insurrection'. Is that like the guy in the frog costume?

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14. jdlshore ◴[30 Oct 25 18:51 UTC] No.45763780{3}[source]▶
> The part that is on fire and suffering from massive insurrection

I assume you’re talking about Portland. Speaking as someone who lives in Portland, you’re grossly misinformed. It’s time to change your filter bubble.

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15. jimbokun ◴[30 Oct 25 18:59 UTC] No.45763881[source]▶
Once you “swing” to authoritarianism the authoritarian doesn’t let you swing back.
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16. jimbokun ◴[30 Oct 25 19:00 UTC] No.45763912{4}[source]▶
They are them.
17. dylan604 ◴[30 Oct 25 19:06 UTC] No.45763968{4}[source]▶
hey, i'm getting my info from the leader of the country. you're saying we can trust our dear leader?

i really wish /s wasn't so damn necessary

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18. amanaplanacanal ◴[30 Oct 25 19:43 UTC] No.45764420[source]▶
I bet the blow back will be sooner than that. I don't expect Trump to serve out his term; he looks and sounds terrible. And Vance doesn't have the mojo that Trump does. Once Trump is gone the Republicans will start eating their own.
19. jdlshore ◴[30 Oct 25 19:49 UTC] No.45764489{5}[source]▶
My bad. In my defense, Poe’s Law.
20. dessimus ◴[30 Oct 25 20:35 UTC] No.45765005{5}[source]▶
Could be that they want to be an exclave like their Kaliningrad friends.
21. joquarky ◴[30 Oct 25 20:58 UTC] No.45765274[source]▶
> I'm definitely ok with 'virtue signalling' though. It's a lot better than vice signalling.

Both inflate the ego.

22. embedding-shape ◴[31 Oct 25 00:05 UTC] No.45766931{3}[source]▶
Yet the people always prevail, but sometimes it does take longer time than others, yea.
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23. chairmansteve ◴[31 Oct 25 02:34 UTC] No.45767722{5}[source]▶
"I'm also curious about the 'massive insurrection'. Is that like the guy in the frog costume?"

That's the guy.

24. adrianN ◴[31 Oct 25 03:07 UTC] No.45767917[source]▶
Authoritarian states and walkable cities are orthogonal problems. You can have car centric city planning in democratic states (see for example the USA).
25. jimbokun ◴[31 Oct 25 14:40 UTC] No.45772466{4}[source]▶
No, they don't.

There are decades and centuries where authoritarians and dictators prevail. There is no timeline for guaranteeing democracy and human rights will prevail.

It takes action, diligence, and sacrifice to preserve those things. And even more to regain them once lost.

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26. embedding-shape ◴[31 Oct 25 15:53 UTC] No.45773489{5}[source]▶
Ok, name one authoritarian state that never fell, besides the authoritarian states we have today?

Of course it eventually falls down, everything does. I'm not saying it won't be difficult, nor many people will ultimately die, and the country will be very different. But it will happen, if not sooner, then later, like in every other place in the world.

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27. embedding-shape ◴[31 Oct 25 16:00 UTC] No.45773581{3}[source]▶
> what makes you so sure it'll fall? plenty of autocracies last for decades, or generations

Because you didn't end your sentence with "Plenty of autocracies last forever" but instead you gave them a duration. Maybe that duration sounds long, but it ends eventually, which is exactly my point.

28. dragonwriter ◴[31 Oct 25 16:06 UTC] No.45773652{6}[source]▶
> Ok, name one authoritarian state that never fell, besides the authoritarian states we have today?

By defintion, if it “never fell”, it would be one of the authoritarian states we have today, so the obvious lack of any example fulfilling that criteria doesn't demonstrate anything one way or the other.

Now, if you could say something like “point to any authoritarian regime existing after <year> that had existed for longer than <span in years>”, that might tend to support the claim that, at least after a certain point in time, authoritarian regimes tended to have a particular finite lifespan (of course, you can never prove that currently-existing regimes aren’t exceptions to that withot access to future knowledge.)

At one point I had a hypothesis based on a few notable examples that with certain definitional bounds this might work with some point in the 20th century and about 80 years (even had a bit of process explanation, though not a strong theory on why it didn't apply earlier beyond the general spread of democratic ideals) but I never rigourously checked if there might be exceptions.

(Of course, plenty of authoritarian regimes fall only to be replaced by different authoritarian regimes, too.)